Frigate skill bonuses:
10% bonus to Remote Armor Repair amount
10% reduction in Remote Armor Repair cap use
Role Bonus:
500% bonus to the range of Remote Armor Repairers

Inquisitor:
Frigate skill bonuses:
10% bonus to Remote Armor Repair amount
10% reduction in Remote Armor Repair cap use
Role Bonus:
500% bonus to the range of Remote Armor Repairers
Slot layout: 3 H, 2 M, 4 L, 2 turrets
Fittings: 51 PWG, 135 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 225 / 500 / 330
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 400 / 200s / 2
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 310 / 3.6 / 1470000 / 4.95s
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 36km / 700 / 7
Sensor strength: 10 Radar
Signature radius: 34
Cargo capacity: 250

how does this not make solo pvp exponentially harder?

I fear it makes soloing impossible. killing frig sized targets can be extremely hard. This forces you to kill them first, while they are tanking hundreds or thousands of applied dps

unlike eaf ewar remote reps stack infinitely.
There is no reason to not spam these ships and b
put every single new player in one

Why do three races lose their mining frigate but Amarr lose their missile frigate?

It should be the tormentor, the fact that it's all ready been turned into the punisher mk2 hints at a complete lack of forethought for these changes.

Oh yey won't EVE be fun when everything is the same. We can't have one damn frigate that's different from all the rest can we!

I await the Abaddon becoming the logistics BS.

tbh i want to see the large reps taken away from tech II logi sihps...

it gives them WAY! too much scaleability for a ship that size...

i would much rather see a new BS added to the game... that used large RR... that would make sense as they have very large sig radius to start with... so with thier ability to rep would come with thier ability to die!

I would even like to see a tech II version logi BS thats used with the target breaker mod... its tech II bonus would reduce the side effects when the mod is active... (this would help counter the blob for smaller gangs)

you mean the ewar frigs?

you know i would not mind the meidum remote reps getting an increase in rep amount per lev to help out logi curisers II... but IMO the range of Large reps is whats making them OP...

but having large reps on a bs sized ship would be OK for me because of the many disadvantages of bs sized ships... large sig radius... slow... bad agility... terribad locking time... and so on...

On that same note.. Nidhogguring the minmatar logistics would be unfortunate.

well no 1 ccp already said they want cruisers to be faster and more agile... so they will end up being nano any ways...

as for the medium vrs large... well 20 km is not so bad... 52 km range is more then enough to kite with... and hey they could always add a rig that could increase the range of RR right?

the only thing i would do i get rid of the drone rep bonus and replace with a rr efficiency bonus... lets say 7.5% per lev... that would take that 192 per medium rep and turn it into 264 to which i would be happy with...

so in practice you are loosing 100 rep per cycle and 20 km... which imo would bring them in line with the fact they are CRUISERS!

also back in the day putting rr on a bs was standard before they boosted the hell out of logi ships... so its not unheard off... plus IMO the bs sized ones would have 7ish high slots so there potential rep amount would make them worth using...

Right now, just with the cruisers, one tech 2 logistic cruiser can outrepair anywhere from 5-10 battleships worth of damage.

*in before the faggots spam stupid arguments to counter this.

If we find that the range isn't enough it is open to possible changes after we roll out the testing. But I don't really want them to be able to sit so far away that catching them becomes extremely difficult.

Putting them right on the edge of longpoint and heavy neut range was intentional.

indeed i just had an argument with liang who forgot about wh space and high sec as a reason not to bring RR in line...

right so thats why you chose to use supercarriers as an example... how good are they in wh space again? or bombs in high sec...

its not a terrible idea... its a great one... one that you PERSONALLY dont agree with... and using t3 bc is kinda cold as they have terribad HP and die easy...
and to this i would suggest how about we just agree to not agree because neither of us is going to convince the other that thier ideas are wrong... but hopefully we have presented reasonable arguments that ccp then can use in internal convos to better enhance the game...

******** arguement number 1... check.

You can just look to the alliance tournament as proof of reality versus theory. You only need 3-4 large repairer and gang bonuses to do massive **** tons of reps. First of all, not everyone is a maxed out implanted dps pilot. Secondly, most BS don't go above about 900 dps in optimal close range practically and fights under those conditions rarely if ever happen. Third if you look at most fleet comps in game these days, they all center around resistance based t2/t3 fleets, or resistance bonused t1 fleets (drake, rokh, abaddon), and range above 50km... again, factoring into the reasonable damage calcs for BS pilots.... 900 dps isn't going to happen at that range.

When you start adding in the counter BS fleets, which are almost always low sig, AB fleets of some sort, their dps falls further off a cliff in most scenarios. Again requiring yet more ways to counter the logistics problem alone rather than having more reasonable counters.

So my statement is true beyond your apparently clumsy eft faggotry math.

So it's looking like FW will become even worse after the winter expansion. Griffins and logistics everywhere, no fun allowed.

Are you so ******** as to say that 1 logistics is able to prevent an entire group of ships from dieing? no, 1 logistic can be killed, which is why my entire arguement surrounds scaling you ******** *******. My point about the tournament was how fights where the SOLO logistic wasn't targeted first showed massive tanking of 3 highly speced cr bs fits, or multiple command ships. Any normal fight won't see such ideal conditions for the offensive side as that tournament showed, and yet the logistics were still highly powerful.

The problem is, there's hardly a counter for logistics, and it wrecks combat to know that you can regularly design nearly unbreakable setups in this game. This game was far better off when logistics weren't so ******* retardedly strong.

Nobody in this game finds it fun when the other side is unbreakable... it just leads to fights that take way too long to decide, for hardly any real action.

Last time you were proposing a -20% reduction of penalties per level for each rigging skill, right?

This is a bit of a tangent question, but does anyone here think that an over-proliferation of logi is going to be a problem? I hear from my nullsec contacts that more and more fleets consist primarily of logi ships (scimis), so would a stacking penalty of some sort on remote repping be a good way to constraint overuse of logi? I mean, the alliance tournament puts a hard limit on logi ships for this reason (boring unkillable stalemate fleets) so perhaps its something that needs to be considered if we're going to see hordes of logi frigates running around.

Fascinating but irrelevant, because that's not what I suggested. Buy new glasses perhaps?

How you should be viewing this is not as "oh cool newbies can get into new ships!" but rather "oh no vets are going to exploit the everloving hell out of these new ships," as the second is going to have more impact on the game as a whole and more of an impact on the new player experience, as they quickly realize that on top of off-grid boosters, they are facing veterans with multiple pocket healers and no viable way to lose their ship.

I genuinely cannot fathom a reason you could see this change as a net positive.

-Please indicate to me a situation in which a logistics frigate would be in hostile heavy neut range.
-Cap booster is irrelevant as anyone who is piloting these will never be in neut range.
-You need ECM on the field to have to worry about ECCM. ECM is not something present very often in small gang or solo situations (especially nano gangs) as you need all available DPS to hit your target and move or tackle and move.

-They are heavy for a frigate and agility will mean little at the range you will be operating at and behind heavy tackle.
-Sig and speed tank called, they say a frigate with a signature radius of 30 is difficult to kill when they are at speed at range.
-Their signature radius is in line with every other frigate (read: small)

If you consider a pilot that is two weeks old transferring 100 raw hp a second to a heavy tackle ship with a resistance bonus miniscule, I honestly don't know what to tell you. Even assuming a terrible fit or a t1 ship with 66% omniresist, that is an effective tank of 300 paper DPS (assuming all dps is applied). With no diminishing returns on transfers, my three newbie logi set up will tank 900 paper DPS, and if I am not flying like an idiot I can tank much more (as not all DPS will be applied).

Your response will naturally be "lol just alpha through it!", which is kinda my point.

I also don't think you grasp the concept of tanking through anything other than EFT numbers (hint: paper DPS is higher than applied dps in 90% of situations)

I must have missed the part where these frigates can only repair other t1 frigates in the context of a frigate brawl.

Probably because that is not how they are going to be used.

You are looking at the whole concept the wrong way.

I've already developed a training schedule that can get the fitting and skills needed for these within a month. With no real cost commitment and no need to micromanage the ships, you are looking at the death of solo and small gang PVP, even moreso than the current state of offgrid boosters.

What's stopping me, or you, or anyone else from creating these and putting a dozen of them into every single fight?

Proliferation of logistics needs to be looked at very seriously given the current state of tanking, especially if you are giving everyone who wants to put in the effort a virtually unlimited supply of cheap, effective RR.

See my edit
...

The only offsetting thing I can imagine is making them significantly more expensive than they currently are or have a higher threshold to get into (or both). Otherwise I will never leave station without at least three RR frigate alts, just like I never leave station without off grid boosting.

I maintained a corporation of 20 catalyst pilots who killed over 150 high-sec exhumers netting me a little over two billion isk.

I think I can manage a few RR pilots.

Edit: Really, they are trivially priced frigates that can use equally cheap meta mods in free (<900ksp) clones. If you want to try to volley the ~1m ISK ship I don't care about in your significantly more expensive ship while I tackle you in whatever ship I care to kill you in, you are more than welcome.

Griffins

Costs are negligible (around 10m/pilot) and ship costs are negligible (~1M per ship).

No need for hyperbole, you'd only bring two or three RR pilots at a time. There is really no reason not to do so.

You don't seem to be getting the gist of how making logistics so ridiculously available is going to be a problem.

You should really read before responding.

The issue is that the logi frigs would not need to be piloted. Set assist, start reps, orbit, done.

You've now set up a situation in which a single player, with minimal investment, can shut down a deadspace area with ease to anything short of a significantly larger group.

Removing 51 day accounts doesn't get rid of the problem of logi frigs replacing triage carriers. The CFC has over 10,000 pilots, with very little training all of them will be able to fly logi frigs. If you have the numbers logi frigs are still better than triage carriers for repping structures.

You are right R&K are not going to be using logi frigs in place of Triage Archons in their next video, but that's not the point I was making.

The question I asked was "Has anyone considered how this will affect 0.0, Structure Repping & Triage Carriers?"
& "What happens when the use of logi frigs is taken to an extreme?"

The example I gave was for afk structure repping with logi frigs in place of triage carriers.

Free 51 day accounts, cheap disposable logi platform & quick training times allow ~200 mil worth of logi frigs to afk rep structures which is currently the domain of triage carriers.

My argument can be found in these links:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1828885#post1828885
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1829004#post1829004